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« Dante's Corner | Main | Violence Erupts At Chieftaincy Consultation Talks »

Monday, 11 August 2008

Comments

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Fon

Azore Opio,
I take distance from this trash associated with narrow-minded and Parochial thinking that will take us 100 years behind.

Sali

Mr Opio,
I can only refer you to another article by Neba Fuh published in his blog: www.nebafuh.com.
Reflect on it.

Compromise Politics- A New Way Out For African Autocrats

By Neba-Fuh

Generally , Africans have a vexing tendency to always dwell on the 'bad, worse and worst' comparison. They rarely dwell on positive comparison , that is,' the good , better and best' situations.Africa When established dictators are under all kinds of pressure to relinquish power, fellow Africans come out with defensive negative comparisons insinuating that, these autocrats are not worse than their contemporaries. It is like the student who took the last-but-one position in his end of year class exams, but was quick to point out that at least, he wasn't the last in the class!

When we decry the dictatorial rule of the Biya regime, some analysts rush to point out that he is not as worse as his neighbours. When there is an opportunity to oust dictators like Mugabe of Zimbabwe, who has plunged his country into an economic quagmire coupled with extreme brutalization of his people because of their political opinions, fellow Africans come out with all kinds of negative comparisons and hypotheses. They hail him for pushing an African Economic Independence fight, while staging a '2,200,000% inflation' economy. They condemn legendary Mandela for leaving power only after five years as President of South Africa, and chastise him for not taking up the 'African Economic Independence fight' , just to defend Mugabe's sadistic regime . What a shame! This is not the progressive mentality Africans need , it is a lose/lose option.

I strongly believe that any pressure to force a dictator to relinquish power, no matter where it is coming from should not be compromised. Any African dictator who is forced out of power brings a smile to at least one hopeless African. Africa's future rests not on this cream of dictators! They are of no use! They can't bring the momentum Africa needs to move from its present inertia to a more progressive track, comparable to the South East Asian boom. The talk about African unity remains a fictional gaffe, except these greedy autocrats quit. The Biyas, Obiang Nguemas, Bongo, Qhaddhaffis, Hosnis,Mugabes, El Bashirs, Kibakis etc can not execute any African vision.

Worst still, today a new precedence is being set for these African autocratic oligarchs to die in power- Compromise Politics-The tendency to use whatever means possible to rig Presidential elections in order to claim victory, and later yield to pressure from other fellow African dictators to form a government of national unity by sharing power with your presidential challenger. This is the new trend African dictators are adopting to stay in power forever. It happened in Kenya a few months ago, it is happening in Zimbabwe now, and surely it will happen to other African nations. If this trend continues, Africa is doomed for everlasting stagnation, and any vision for Africa in a conceivable future is just an illusion.

Any government or executive leadership that cannot be changed by generally accepted means designed by its people is not democratic. This is the bedrock of democracy, and all other things are secondary! Therefore, such a government or executive leadership that resist change by a consensus process predetermined freely by the people themselves and done at an accepted time frame, is a dictatorship. It is as simple as that!
The agenda and motive of the anybody who aspires for the post of President can only be judged by the people. If they vote him to power in a free and fair election, that is their business. The truth is that if the system is democratic then the people can still usher him out when his mandate expires. African politics has not move from person-centred politics to system-centred politics. We still believe individual rulers solely hold the key to a nation's destiny, just like a faithful dog looks up to his master daily to determine its fate. This is as a result of the ethnocentric tendency of African culture . The only way forward for any African leap is to adopt a system-based leadership- where political and economic systems
are put in place to ensure basic continuity irrespective of who sits in the system-controlled executive seat. In such a system, dictators cannot be glorified, Oligarchs who rule their country infinitely cannot be hailed. Incumbents who rig elections with impunity will not be welcome in the African leadership family. This is the kind of Africa we wish for, where we dwell in the realm of the 'good, better and best' situation.
God save Africa!


Ma Mary

Driving immigrant populations away is an awful idea. Human beings have always migrated. Even in ancient Africa, people were always on the move. Few ethnicities have been in their present positions for more than 500 years.

Opio, this is jingoistic rant, the irrefutable crimes of the west nonwithstanding. Mugabe's is short term emotional, self-serving thinking.

espoir

THE BRITS ARE JUST FIGHTING FOR THE INTEREST of their fellow white race.they dont have the interest of black zimbabweans at heart.they wanted to continue to see a situation where by the minority of zimbabweans owned the land and the black majotity worked for them on the field and the kepted on using their capitalistic tendencies to manupulate the people on food supply and getting rich.this was not the original agreement from the agreement the rhodesia goverment signed with robert mugabe and his commorades.
mugabe is an african icon.he has stood up for all africans.he is a symbol of black supremacy over the injustice of the whites.
i personally do not condole the total seisure of farm lands from whites by the zanu-pf govrnment but i think mugabe was provoked because of the reluatance and sluggish-ness by the brits to foster the agreements between lan smit and the liberation fighters of which britain was a facilitator.
let the west please stop treating Africans like children and come into a partnership.i believe that is what we ask of them.

Essono

Azore Opio has a point.The West particularly Britain has no moral standing to tell us how we should manage our welfare.It is better we are ruled by our own dictators(who by the way were installed by the West) than by an alien people.

The very British turned their faces away when Mugabe crushed the Ndebele resistance with his fifth brigade in Operation Gukurahundi from 1982 to 87 with ab't 10,000 Ndebele's murdered.

Where were the British when in 2005 Mugabe launched Operation Murambatsvina in which more than 2.5 million people(black Zimbabweans) in the slums were forced out of their houses.But when whites suffer the same fate,Her Majesty transforms from white to pink and then to red.Hypocrisy at its best.

Pavel Muron

I am starting to be very worry about reputation of The Post. I have read in last times some very poor articles and this is one of them. So much written with hatred and jingoism. I am currently working for biggest organisation dealing with migration - IOM. The right to migrate should have everyone who wish so. As a white man I assist refugees in Thailand (formerly staying in Buea) mainly from Burma (but also from Ethiopia and Sudan, we had even somebody from Camerooon)on their way to resettle in another country to start a new better life.
Dear Opio you are a shame of Cameroonians !!! I wish you to meet Mugabe´s secret police, they would give you proper lesson about hatred.

Ma Mary

Pavel, I oppose Mugabe, but the inconsistencies of the British that Opio points out are true. They are shameless and insulting. When they started asking people like Paul Biya to lecture Mugabe on human rights at the African Union summit, I thought they were joking or think we are idiots. Where I disagree with Opio is that he is making excuses for Mugabe. You should equally not make excuses for the West talking on the two sides of its mouth.

I am equally hoping that the fact that you are a white man should not matter. You are just a man. Think about that. Be consistent.

Essono

Pavel Muron,

Cudos for the humanitarian work u guys are doing at the IOM.I think ur work with people from LDC's has unleashed ur sensitivity to the sufferings of people from economically weak nations.Reason why u should be in a better position to understand the anger the West has generated and whom the rest of the poor considers a "hypocritical mammoth".Giving lessons on democracy when it suits them best maeanwhile erecting the most violent dictators in minerally rich nations.

However,its not only Western gov'ts that are are culpable.I think the people also share in this guilt.Westerners have the power to hold their gov'ts into account for the vagaries of their multinational companies but most them wouldn't even care a dime about what's going on beyond their gardens.They have the possiblity to bring about greater equality in issues plaguing poor nations.

Was at a conference on global trade in which farmers were invited.They testified that they were given $25,000 per annum.Some even "joked" at the fact that with less than a third of that money they could still maintain the same productivity levels.Some even confessed that they find ways to use that money to invest in other businesses.Most of us Africans at conference simply walked out of the conference.

Millions of people are dying everyday,bc their agriculture has been virtually destroyed and group of people choose to make fun of it.If these farmers can in solidarity with African farmers refuse to accept these exhorbitant subsidies,they would've been uplifting millions of families who depend solely depend on agriculture for their livelihoods.But would they?And when Africans risk live and limb to cross the Maghreb into the fortified walls of the West,the same farmers who can't see beyond their farms go on Ku Klux Klan Jihad against foreigners especially Africans.HYPOCRISY.


eyallow

This is an issue that is difficult to take sides in and again exceeding hard not to take sides almost impossible to hang in-between!

However, Opio himself is a Ugandan that has become Cameroonian. That totally puts to question his objectives for this article. He is a man that has travelled the world and lived in many countries before settling in Cameroon! Therefore he should understand the virtues attached with freedom of movement for every person on our planet!

He articulates obvious points and sometimes it makes sense to define the blackman as an angry man because the reasons why they should be bitter are obvious.

It equally makes sense to ascribe to the whiteman the term imperalists and invaders for obvious reasons as well because history makes us what we are and what we will become!

But we can't keep marking time on the same spot. We have to move beyond the wrongs and evils others before us orchestrated and become more accepting.

Mugabe is not a good person in anyway and that does not make the English saints because their scars are littered all over over earth; from across all of Africa to New Zealand's Mori people, Australia's Aborigenees and the indians in America.

I have always tried not to let these obvious atrocities blind my believe in humanism which is what we should be forwarding at this moment in time, that is if we ever hope to become a one earth set to achieve the same goal.

Those that walk the corridors of power however have another intention it seems.

Its a bitter piece Opio has written, filled with hate, racism and xenophobia, yet it is a piece hightlighting why the above has resulted.

There is nothing as hard as a blackman trying to settle in a whiteman's nation. The rules are tough, the laws prohibiting...

Our lands have always been open to everyone. We have always been an accepting people, tolerant and forgiving....Maybe we should learn a lesson, that inasmuch as we uphold this virtue, some people will always take us for a ride.

People should not forget that many many white people are generous, mourning and protesting against the evil their own kind are inflicting on others. But something seems to have been written down in concrete defining the leaders they get, those that uphold the zeal to suppress and enslave...

Catch 22!

SET

Lapiro de Mbanga: The Emasculation of Cameroonians

Only in Cameroon, would an artist, political activist, local representative and voice of the people like Lambo Pierre Roger aka Lapiro de Mbanga; be arrested, tortured and detained indefinitely, and still not a finger raised from those he has fought for all his life.

Only in Cameroon , would a government descend to such lows; as arresting the people’s poet, the voice of the voiceless and representative of the downtrodden and concoct charges against him and still be sure that not a single Cameroonian would raise their voice. Yes, Only in Cameroon !!!

Only Cameroonians would look the other way, while the one man who has spent over 20 years fighting against a system of marginalization, exclusion, corruption, etc get arrested, barred from seeing his family, tortured and vilified by a regime without currency. Yes, only Cameroonians would allow Lapiro de Mbanga to rot in jail. As I write these words he is seriously ill in the Nkongsamba jail where he is being detained.

Only in Cameroon, can a handful of men, decide to amend the constitution and indefinitely hand the destinies of over 18 million people to a man, who has brought nothing but 25 years of misery to the same people. As Lapiro would say, « après 25 ans de gabegie, est-ce que somting fit changer? »

Yes, only Cameroonians! !! I can still remember how the people in Myanmar made sure to buzz like mosquitoes in the ears of the Military junta, until Su Su Nway’s was released. Yes, how long were we kept awake by the cries and struggles of the Myanmar people, pushing and shoving the rest of the world for her release? Don’t we still hear of Aung San Suu Kyi, even after this long? Yes, and Nway, had been an activist for a couple of years. Lapiro has been one all his life.

For the few days that Arundhati Roy was arrested by the Indian authorities, the nation came to a standstill and the citizens made it a point to rally the rest of the world and make sure she was released. That is how Indians would react. They decided to go to jail with her until her release.

Nelson Mandela has become the icon he is today, because the people of South Africa rallied for his release, and the ANC, the party to which he belonged made his the face and the name of the struggle. For 27 years, they didn’t not relent until he was released. That is why during his 90th Anniversary celebration two weeks ago, he made it clear that he owed everything to the people of South Africa and the ANC in particular. Would Lapiro be able to say the same of us in future?

Fela fought for the down trodden of Nigeria and was sure that he had the support of at least Kalakuta Republic , if not of the rest of Nigeria . Countless times he was arrested, and countless times he got all the support he didn’t ask for. Today, apart from Joe La Conscience, not one single Cameroonian artist has shown solidarity towards one of their own. Yes, the Fela of Cameroon has been abandoned by those he dug the trenches with. His own ‘complices dem for Mboko”. Yes only in Cameroon , would the junta arrest ‘Fela’ and we all go about our business as usual. In fact only Cameroonian men and women would watch in stupefying docility, at their own emasculation! !!

Is it not time we took our manhood back? Is it not time perhaps, that we took a long, long look at ourselves, our country and our responsibility towards that country?

When the people in Cameroon rose as one huge wave and made a strong statement, during the February protests, they were playing their part, and that led to the deaths of over a hundred. It is understandable then, the intimidation they have been subjected to on a daily basis by Biya and his acolytes. The people are being brutalized, tortured and killed, without fear of reprisals.

The Fundamental Role of Cameroonians in the Diaspora

But what about Cameroonians in the Diaspora? Are we totally ignorant of what is happening at home? Have we finally found a way to completely disconnect with the country of our birth? Well, one thing is certain, the responsibility now lies with each and every single Cameroonian residing outside the country to play their own small role and expose the junta we have been subjected to. A junta that has turned us into nothing but chess pieces; In Constitution Constipée Lapiro says:

Toute manipulation arbitraire de cette constitution

Est une menace contre l’intégrité de la nation toute entière

Tous les Camerounais ne sont pas d’un même parti

Tous les Camerounais ne sont pas des politiciens

Et les Camerounais de la Diaspora ne sont des Camerounais entièrement appart

Car, la vie de tout ce monde compte.

We therefore have a duty to ourselves and our country to act, and to act now! That action must start with the liberation of Lapiro de Mbanga.

If we can lobby for McCain/Obama, debate Zimbabwe , study China , support English league clubs, the least we can do for our country is be responsible citizens. For once we have to pull our resources together and challenge the junta in Yaoundé. Show them that if we do not act, it is not because we are stupid. It is time to prove them wrong, and what better way than to defend the people champion at his hour of weakness?

Nothing you do in your county, town, city, province, country of residence is too small. Write petitions, lobby governments, stage protest marches, send memos, anything, everything, that would draw attention to the plight of our people, and what better subject than Lapiro de Mbanga. Let us prove Lapiro right, when he says “And Cameroonians in the Diaspora are Cameroonians not totally apart”. Let us synchronise our efforts world wide and make sure to act as one big unstoppable Tsunami. Let us act now.

Fon M'ndere

nihilism01

I dont even know where to begin. This guy is a Idiot.

Pavel Muron

For Ma Mary,
Yes, I agree on your points. You are right. Doesn’t matter if I am white, black, green or blue is just colour...But let us use different terminology. I don’t like when somebody uses general terms. British did this and that ....not British but British politicians, a few foolish people with such a huge power, or West what is it? Is it G8 (8 men) or governments of biggest European countries + USA or just everybody some hundreds millions of people...? Normal people have nothing to do with politics and you can not blame them just because of their nationality as some Africans do. You are American and this is your fault and this as well bla bla bla. It looks like that next American president is going to be Afro-American, many white people voted for him, so people can´t be so racist. People in Yaounde on the street were shouting on me Sarcozy, Sarcozy. O well I am Czech and I have bloody nothing to do with Sarcozy or French politics. During one year of my stay in Buea I had a few conflicts with people because of my colour of skin. For example they forbad me to entry the pub that I am white and pub is just for black. But in Czech Republic, England or everywhere would happen probably the same sometimes. Racists are just everywhere. But how do you want to explain me that so many people complain about USA, but almost everybody wants to go there? Many people complaining about Britain and France, but everybody are watching their football matches? Is probably same like us...British people don’t like Indians, but everybody goes to Indian restaurant. Some guys are against migration from Africa, but all of them would date black woman and all teams want to have Eto´o.
Let’s go back to the topic. I have to admit you are of course right about two sides of mouth. Who is useful for western governments (Biya, Obiang etc) they let them do whatever they want. I found it absolutely ridiculous that on one side you can find such a huge report about human rights on website of US embassy in Yaounde and in December American military boat came to Limbe and American soldiers were giving training to Cameroonian Army who later shooted innocent people in February events. This approach is of course totally wrong. Let me tell you Biya is respectful by western powers because his ability to keep Cameroon in peace and to maintain quite good economic outlook comparing to other sub Saharan countries. Maybe peace isn’t Biya´s achievement and it comes from your characteristic that Cameroonians are very peaceful people. I don’t know where is true.
For Essono,
We are speaking about 2 different things....me development aid and you agriculture subsidies. Development aid was for many years on bad path in Africa, but I think is really improving and some organisations do really good job over there now and you can find very committed individuals trying to make better world for everybody. As you said agricultural subsidies from USA and European Union are really killing Africans. As I know there are 3x times bigger then development aid and every stupid cow in EU receives 2 Euro a day from them. For example our Czech agriculture was buried a few years ago, because in Czech government gives you 20% of price of agricultural product as subsidy but in France is 60%, in Switzerland 80% !!! So you find apples on every garden, but in shops apples are from France.
For eyallow
that’s nice written comment. I have travelled in 50 countries, staying longer in England in Buea and now Thailand. So I think I can compare as well. Well, I have never before experienced such a problem to get visa like to Cameroon. Immediately you want to go to Cameroon you are suspicious. They refused me visa in Germany and England, finally got it in Russia. But that’s from government side. Otherwise I have to say I was welcomed by people where I stayed (GRA, Boqwango). It’s not just for black man difficult to get visa or settle in western countries. But it’s also difficult for Asian people or for East-Europeans as me. Some people in the western countries were showing me that I am for them 2nd category person. They think we steal their jobs, but if we don’t do it, nobody else does. I am citizen of EU but I can’t work in Germany, France, Italy...but all of them can work in Czech Republic. So don’t look Africans like only marginalised group of people. Most important thing Africans need to look to the future and not to the past all the times. It wouldn’t help it.

Essono

Pavel Muron,

I am totally at variance with some of the points u've raised above.You simplify things that are very sensitive to the African.I understand,bc u aren't an African and no matter the length of time u've lived in Africa,u will never fully comprehend our fundamental problems.

I will start by tackling ur very last sentence.Yes,as much as Affricans must throw themselves into the future they must however into the rear view of history to order to right the wrongs of the past.No society can evolve without taking cognisance of its history bc every society is shaped by its past even your societies.

I don't buy that claim that u were barred from entering a pub in Camerron bc u're white.And I can bet on my head Pavel,that even if that happened it is in reaction to the racism that blacks face in E'pe.Africans particularly in Cameroon are generally a very cordial and warm people.We were never groomed in a discriminatory society.Black people learned racial discrimination from the whiteman.That is the blatant truth Pavel.

No,u're off the mark Pavel,we are speaking of the same thing.Your rejoinder to Ma Mary's buttresses this.My comment above was trying to highlight several issues;responsiblity of Western gov'ts,issue of subsidies and the inertia on the part of Westerners,whom I consider as equally culpable same as their gov'ts bc they have the possiblity and the power to hold their gov'ts into account for the vagaries of their gov'ts and multinantional companies on the African continent.But they won't do it,bc they are the primary beneficiaries of the exploitative and hypocritical policies of their gov'ts.

That's why I made allusion to a conference on Global Trade in which some farmers saw nothing wrong with the subsidies they're awarded annually.These farmers are a reflection of the larger majority of the Western citizenry.

U can't claim here that "normal people have nothing with politics".That's not true Pavel and u know it.These people live in societies that are democratically entrenched and can influence the public as well as the international policies of their gov'ts contrary to our societies where we almost helpless in the face of our politicians.

To clearify u once and for all ab't the issue of peace in Cameroon,note this;peace in this c'ntry rests on the Cameroonians.Our history has been to larger extent void of violence reason why Cameroon is peaceful.Biya is simply a lucky man to be presiding over such a c'ntry.

The West should accept its guilt and quit this policy of shying away from their guilt.Continuing in this atmosphere would push more and more peoples to become antagonistic towards the West.The world is unsafe today bc the West doesn't recognise the wrongs it has inflicted on peoples across this globe.

Essono

Pls ignore the errors.Faulty keyboard.

Have an anecdote.If my memory isn't as faulty as the keyboard am using,I remember that in late 2006 and early 2007,the Economic Partnership agreements were signed between the EU and ACP(African,Carribean and Pacific c'ntries).The agreements for free trade between the EU and ACP nations.We all know the nefarious consequences of these agreements on our weak economies.The Cameroon gov't recently acknowledge their stupidity in rushing to sign it.Well,Cameroon is going to be loosing more than $2,400 billion in the next 10 yrs or so.

However,protest marches were organised by Africans in the diaspora against these agreements but what shocked me was the fact that not single European civil society group joined to show their solidarity.This is a clear indication that most Westerners donot care about what happens "beyond their gardens" until when the poverty of Africans is brought to their doorsteps by migrants.

Kappa

Pavel is just one of them ignorant white boys!!!

eyallow

Kappa,

I differ with you strongly on behalf of Pavel.

The sole fact that he is in here discussing this issue, indicates his commitments to the issues that afflict us as humans. And that he clearly identifies his race is also an important fact I really admire.


He might not understand what me and you experience, but he tries because most whites really dont give a damn. They won't even read what we are writing here or if they do they will dismiss it as whining Africans and their problems!

Also he has his own issues with the way he has been treated even though he is white and I fully understand because I know that eastern europeans in europe are sometimes even treated worse than black people.

One reason is that the history existing between the black and white races has now made it difficult for open attacks and discrimination to be passed onto a black person for fear of onvious racism. This is not the case for Pavel and others from his part of the world.

We have a slightly different kind of immunity based on historical records and eastern europeans have a kind of immunity based on colour which we dont have yet they are marginalized and it can be brutal!

Objectivity in this matter will yield fruits. Throwing abusive words around is a thing reserved for dwarf minded people!

eyallow

Pavel Muron,

I am totally at variance with some of the points u've raised above.You simplify things that are very sensitive to the African.I understand,bc u aren't an African and no matter the length of time u've lived in Africa,u will never fully comprehend our fundamental problems.

I will start by tackling ur very last sentence.Yes,as much as Affricans must throw themselves into the future they must however into the rear view of history to order to right the wrongs of the past.No society can evolve without taking cognisance of its history bc every society is shaped by its past even your societies.

I don't buy that claim that u were barred from entering a pub in Camerron bc u're white.And I can bet on my head Pavel,that even if that happened it is in reaction to the racism that blacks face in E'pe.Africans particularly in Cameroon are generally a very cordial and warm people.We were never groomed in a discriminatory society.Black people learned racial discrimination from the whiteman.That is the blatant truth Pavel.

No,u're off the mark Pavel,we are speaking of the same thing.Your rejoinder to Ma Mary's buttresses this.My comment above was trying to highlight several issues;responsiblity of Western gov'ts,issue of subsidies and the inertia on the part of Westerners,whom I consider as equally culpable same as their gov'ts bc they have the possiblity and the power to hold their gov'ts into account for the vagaries of their gov'ts and multinantional companies on the African continent.But they won't do it,bc they are the primary beneficiaries of the exploitative and hypocritical policies of their gov'ts.

That's why I made allusion to a conference on Global Trade in which some farmers saw nothing wrong with the subsidies they're awarded annually.These farmers are a reflection of the larger majority of the Western citizenry.

U can't claim here that "normal people have nothing with politics".That's not true Pavel and u know it.These people live in societies that are democratically entrenched and can influence the public as well as the international policies of their gov'ts contrary to our societies where we almost helpless in the face of our politicians.

To clearify u once and for all ab't the issue of peace in Cameroon,note this;peace in this c'ntry rests on the Cameroonians.Our history has been to larger extent void of violence reason why Cameroon is peaceful.Biya is simply a lucky man to be presiding over such a c'ntry.

The West should accept its guilt and quit this policy of shying away from their guilt.Continuing in this atmosphere would push more and more peoples to become antagonistic towards the West.The world is unsafe today bc the West doesn't recognise the wrongs it has inflicted on peoples across this globe.


Posted by: Essono | Thursday, 14 August 2008 at 07:04 AM

Pls ignore the errors.Faulty keyboard.

Have an anecdote.If my memory isn't as faulty as the keyboard am using,I remember that in late 2006 and early 2007,the Economic Partnership agreements were signed between the EU and ACP(African,Carribean and Pacific c'ntries).The agreements for free trade between the EU and ACP nations.We all know the nefarious consequences of these agreements on our weak economies.The Cameroon gov't recently acknowledge their stupidity in rushing to sign it.Well,Cameroon is going to be loosing more than $2,400 billion in the next 10 yrs or so.

However,protest marches were organised by Africans in the diaspora against these agreements but what shocked me was the fact that not single European civil society group joined to show their solidarity.This is a clear indication that most Westerners donot care about what happens "beyond their gardens" until when the poverty of Africans is brought to their doorsteps by migrants.

Posted by: Essono | Thursday, 14 August 2008 at 07:52 AM

Pavel is just one of them ignorant white boys!!!

Posted by: Kappa | Thursday, 14 August 2008 at 08:39 AM

Kappa,

I differ with you strongly on behalf of Pavel.

The sole fact that he is in here discussing this issue, indicates his commitment to the issues that afflict us as humans as a whole. And that he clearly identifies his race is also an important fact I really admire.


He might not understand what me and you experience, but he tries because most whites really dont give a damn. They won't even read what we are writing here or if they do they will dismiss it as whining Africans and their problems!

Also he has his own issues with the way he has been treated even though he is white and I fully understand because I know that eastern europeans in europe are sometimes even treated worse than black people.

One reason is that the history existing between the black and white races has now made it difficult for open attacks and discrimination to be passed onto a black person for fear of obvious racism. This is not the case for Pavel and others from his part of the world.

We have a slightly different kind of immunity based on historical records and eastern europeans have a kind of immunity based on colour which we dont have yet they are marginalized and it can be brutal!

Objectivity in this matter will yield fruits. Throwing abusive words around is a thing reserved for dwarf minded people!

eyallow

Kappa,

I differ with you strongly on behalf of Pavel.

The sole fact that he is in here discussing this issue, indicates his commitment to the issues that afflict us as humans as a whole. And that he clearly identifies his race is also an important fact I really admire.


He might not understand what me and you experience, but he tries because most whites really dont give a damn. They won't even read what we are writing here or if they do they will dismiss it as whining Africans and their problems!

Also he has his own issues with the way he has been treated even though he is white and I fully understand because I know that eastern europeans in europe are sometimes even treated worse than black people.

One reason is that the history existing between the black and white races has now made it difficult for open attacks and discrimination to be passed onto a black person for fear of obvious racism. This is not the case for Pavel and others from his part of the world.

We have a slightly different kind of immunity based on historical records and eastern europeans have a kind of immunity based on colour which we dont have yet they are marginalized and it can be brutal!

Objectivity in this matter will yield fruits. Throwing abusive words around is a thing reserved for dwarf minded people!

Pavel Muron

Dear Essono,
Thank you for your comment. Where to start...
1. To understand the present time and the future you need to know your past that´s right but you can’t blame colonialism for all problems for another hundred years. I also as Czech don’t blame Germans that they attacked Czechoslovakia or Russia that by its politics ruined one of most industrial country in the world somewhere to place 60-70th. Now we are just slowly moving up…
2. Story with pub really happened. Maybe black man learnt racial discrimination from white man, but why is that? It doesn’t mean that if I behave badly to you, you have to behave badly to me as well, if I am bad man, you learn to be bad man....
3. Responsibility of western governments….yes I admit your claim. You are very right. But are agricultural subsidies and TNC the biggest problem for Africa or Cameroon? I don´t think so. Definitely the biggest problem in Cameroon is corruption, which is done by Cameroonians. Money for development aid is disappearing immediately in Yaounde and never reaches needy people. Then I would say bad governance, tribalism …You can oppose now as you said you are helpless in face of your politicians. Well do something with that, don´t resignate, they are tools...We have principle of indirect democracy. I vote representatives of parliament; some of them become members of government later. But I didn’t vote in favor of government ruling party, so what do I have common with Czech international politics? Bush last time won by 50,7%, now his popularity stands at 28%. So what the person voting aganst him can do about Iraq, G8, WTO...Well they protest hardly every single time of conference such a G8, WB, IMF or WTO. Have you noticed that?
To Kappa
However, I raised some critics against Africans I do not recognize myself as ignorant white man. Why would I lose one year of my life volunteering in Cameroon as project consultant in NGO, collaborating in Malaria Roll Back programmme, AIDS/HIV local committees..? Nobody gave me even one Euro to support me. I spent there all my savings. Even I paid my field trips to Muyuka, Kumba, Ekondo, Mundemba, Barombi, Fontem, Azi....Why I would work now for another NGO helping Sudanese, Somalis, Ethiopians to ressetle in safe country ? I would bet I have same number of black friends as you do, maybe even more.
To eyellow
thanks for supportive comment. I appreciate very much. Of course I would never understand Africa as you do, howewer I am trying my best. I lived in London for a while. Poles, Czechs and Lithuanians are really in worse position then some black people over there. Friend of my friend was killed by Scotish just because he had good job in Scotland and he was Czech...

Essono

Dear Pavel,

Thanx 4 taking off some of ur time to exchange with us.Diversity of opinions in debates enlivens it and broadens our knowledge in specific issues.

My finger is still on this button;that the western citizenry has still not done enough to pressurise their gov'ts to change their policies vis-à-vis Africa and Cameroon in particular.In an increasing globalising world,our destinies are continually being wrapped in the same garments of destiny.

The farmer from Santa who sells off his farm bc he can't maker any profits from the crops he grows will eventually sell off his farm to finance his eldest son's trip through the Sahara to E'pe via the long,tortuous sea route into fortified Europe.And that street sweeper who smiles at me every morning on my way to school will certainly shake his fists at me next time I bypass him when he soon realises that his job is under the threat of being taken by away by an African.

I don't blame just like I always tell all my white friends who naively believe that colonialism is over,that it has simply been readjusted and made covert by a more "subtle" form of post-colonialism;NEO-colonialism.That is the present international economic agreements which former colonial powers have instrumentalised to keep their former colonies under their control.

I earlier made mention of the EPA's and the machinations of the Bretton Woods institutions(World Bank,IMF) all geared at ripping the economic soul of Africa.

I know my people well,Pavel and I believe that if u were sent off a pub,it was a way of making whites back in E'pe to realise that when they discriminate on blacks,they must know that the same thing can be done to their compatriots when they come over to Africa.I nevertheless,abhor such behaviour.

Yes corruption is the one of the biggest problems in Africa,but when money is siphoned from our Treasuries where is it neatly stashed?I don't know of any African c'ntry that has ever been known to receive such money.Swiss Banks,Prince Albert of Monaco's exotic palaces etc are the destinations of these funds whose pecuniary interests are used to develop these E'pean El Dorados.

Small wonder these places are the "economic nirvanas" of E'pe.While the real owners of that money are perishing for want of basic necessities.And as if this is not enough,when the compatriots of those who stashed these monies abroad finally kick out these dictators and ask for the monies to be repartriated it turns into another imbroglio.France and some other E'pean nations have still not repartriated the totality of the funds swindled by the Mobutu's,Abacha's,Moussa Traoré's etc, decades afeter these men were swept from power.

Yes,tribalism is a problem but that's another issue.By the way Pavel,what do u say to the critics who think that some of these international NGO's are a means by the West to continue to keep Africa in perpetual dependence?

Pavel Muron

Dear Essono,
I can just agree with everything you said. My essential point at the beginning just was that no all Europeans or Americans are negligent towards Africa and that not every critics should be connected with colonialism. Well, it’s not easy to get involved people in Africa issues because of course they are interested about their lives in their country. If I say to my friend why he is complaining about his situation that is still perfect comparing to some people in Africa, he just replied ,,I did not compare myself with somebody from Africa I compared myself with my neighbors or my friends“....However the world is more and more globalized, people are more and more closed into themselves I would say. If I understood well you are living in western country. I am sure you have noticed many organizations or individuals who try to raise the Africa issues and to promote Africa in good light, not so?
Western countries are strongly against migration. That’s absolutely right. It’s simply consequence of their former colonial politics, but they don’t admit that and don’t take responsibility. My opinion is that everybody should have equal opportunities. Migrants find themselves in very harsh conditions abroad. I knew many Senegalese fluently speaking three world languages and having uni degrees working on the streets in Italy. But I wasn’t in better position neither, having two diplomas I was working on lowest farm work in UK, because employers just didn’t care about my education and experienced gained outside in Czech R.
You raised the issue of foreign debts on African countries, which by my opinion should be considered as illegitimate if went to people as Mobutu. However again, western governments see them perfectly OK. Recently big part part of Cameroon foreign debt was wiped out, that’s good but it’s necessary to watch government’s commitments to invest these money to basic infrastructure.
I admit the claim Africa is in the kind of post-colonialism era and many E´pean experts on Africa would tell you same. As always Darwin´s right of stronger applies. I can just say East Europe goes through similar process of economic exploitation. While Austrian farmer can make living owing 3 cows, Czech farmer can’t make living even with 30 cows... But all of us we should watch out for China as well. Cameroon is too friendly towards Chinese as Czech and others are. Almost everything you buy comes from there. While Chinese businessmen have open access to everything in Cameroon, Czech, Hungary...We don´t have the same there...
About your last question, do you speak just about NGO´s or WB, IMF, WTO included ? These three last mentioned organisations are doing really bad job in Africa and yes they will continue to keep Africa in economic dependence. But if we speak clearly about NGO´s like Medecins sans bordiers, Save the children, Oxfam, Caritas, Adra I think they are mainly doing great job and get involve local communities in projects implementation what is essential. Some UN agencies (UNICEF, UNHCR, UNDP) and government’s development agencies as CIDA, NORAD, GTZ, JICA etc are doing good job too and helps Africans to make their lives easier and to become independent.
I would like to share with all of you more, if you wish same my e-mail address is kalikut@seznam.cz

Ma Mary

Pavel, you do not want to be mistaken for a French in francophone Africa. Speak English as much as possible. Too many French folks work for monopolistic corporations or are part of secret service networks, and they have caused a lot of damage in Africa. They are regarded with suspicion.

If you find racism, it is new and is a product of the kind of treatment that Africans get in Europe.

BTW- Prague is IMHO the most beautiful city in Europe.

Pavel Muron

Ma Mary,
Anglophones vs Francophones. We haven’t raise this issue here yet. I don´t want to speak badly about Francophones, but let me just say my reality. In Anglophone part I haven’t been check by police even once. In francophone part they picked me up every single time. When I told them that I don’t speak French and that English is official language in whole Cameroon, they started shout at me. However, I own residence permit in Cameroon they sometimes pulled me out of bus to make me explain them what I am doing there and bla bla bla. Anglophones were always willing to help me about transport and finding out some offices. In Yaounde they turned around to show me their back always. I could only have some conversation with taxi drivers who were actually originally from Bamenda. Once I entered taxi in Buea and soldier greeted me Bonjour, well I replied Good Morning, shouting started again...Francophones learnt from French people how to be arrogant. You don’t find really many E´peans who like French...
Thanks for compliment about Prague. Many people find it as the most beautiful city in the world. It’s just I am from Northeast. I speak differently then Prague people do. Many of them never been in my region and they called Far East and don’t like our people. Well, I loved Prague as city but don’t really like arrogance of people there. But I think people from capital cities are always like that, need to look important and be bossy...

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